http://www.zogby.com/…

One in five American adults - 22% - believe that any state or region has the right to “peaceably secede from the United States and become an independent republic,” a new Middlebury Institute/Zogby International telephone poll shows.

I believe any state or region has the right to peaceably secede and become an independent republic:
Agree	22%
Disagree	73%
Not sure	5%

The level of support for the right of secession was consistent in every region in the country, though the percentage was slightly higher in the South (26%) and the East (24%).  The figures were also consistent for every age group, but backing was strongest among younger adults, as 40% among those age 18 to 24 and 24% among those age 25 to 34 agreed states and regions have secession rights.

Broken down by race, the highest percentage agreeing with the right to secede was among Hispanics (43%) and African-Americans (40%). Among white respondents, 17% said states or regions should have the right to peaceably secede.

I would support a secessionist effort in my state:
Agree	18%
Disagree	72%
Not sure	10%

Politically, liberal thinkers were much more likely to favor the right to secession for states and regions, as 32% of mainline liberals agreed with the concept. Among the very liberal the support was only slightly less enthusiastic - 28% said they favored such a right. Meanwhile, just 17% of mainline conservatives thought it should exist as an option for states or regions of the nation.

Asked whether they would support a secessionist movement in their own state, 18% said they would, with those in the South most likely to say they would back such an effort. In the South, 24% said they would support such an effort, while 15% in the West and Midwest said the same. Here, too, younger adults were more likely than older adults to be supportive - 35% of those under age 30 would support secession in their state, compared to just 17% of those over age 65. Among African Americans, 33% said they would support secession, compared to just 15% of white adults. The more education a respondent had, the less likely they were to support secession - as 38% of those with less than a high school diploma would support it, compared to just 10% of those with a college degree.

To gauge the extent to which support for secession comes from a sense that the nation’s current system is not working, a separate question was asked about agreement that “the United States’ system is broken and cannot be fixed by traditional two-party politics and elections.” Nearly half of respondents agreed with this statement, with 27% who somewhat agree and 18% who strongly agree.

I believe the United States’ system is broken and cannot be fixed by traditional two-party politics and elections:
Agree	44%
Disagree	53%
Not sure	3%

The telephone poll, conducted by Zogby International, included 1,209 American adult respondents. It was conducted July 9-13, 2008, and carries a margin of error of +/- 2.9 per cent.

Just to stir shit up (not that I’m interested in arguing about this): so with these numbers and bosco’s previous statements on secession. 22% of those polled are tin foil hat wearers.

The last question is particularly encouraging.

… or Secession Day or antiauthoritarian day or …

A few articles to check out while waiting for the hotdogs and burgers to cook.

A Fresh Look at Holidays - Butler Shaffer

Just how far we have contorted our thinking about “independence day” is reflected in most people’s thinking about fireworks. Like private gun-ownership, our personal use of fireworks represents too much power in the hands of individuals. And so, we confine ourselves to the absurdity of having the state celebrate our liberty and independence for us!

July 4th In Bizarro World - Manuel Lora

What follows are just a few of the July 4th lies and errors that we are supposed to blindly accept:

• The military is glorious, its heroes heroic, and our support is patriotic
• Freedom is about authority
• The police keep us safe and have a duty to protect us
• We are better off now than when the war on drugs started decades ago
• Continually increasing prices is a product of the market and thus the central bank must control credit and the money supply
• With proper reform, government can become efficient, especially if we elect the right leaders
• The Constitution gives people rights
• The government has been formed by the consent of the governed
• Without the state regulating/subsidizing/taxing/prohibiting activity or industry X, said industry or activity would be produced in quantities and/or qualities that are too high or too low; or would run rampant, cartelize and monopolize the market; or would not survive in a predatory competitive environment
• The more politically democratic things are, the better for everyone
• No matter what the cost to the public, protecting the children/our veterans/our senior citizens/our teachers is always the number one priority
• The free movement of goods and people destroys jobs and threatens our standard of living
• Businesses have no incentives to keep their customers safe; licenses ensure fair practices
• The law may occasionally be wrong, but it should nonetheless be followed always
• We must forever give up essential liberties to guarantee safety: it’s for your own good

Happy Secession Day! - Thomas DiLorenzo

That’s what Thomas Jefferson would be celebrating today. Unlike so many Americans, he would not be celebrating the American empire, with its “unitary executive,” swarms of tax-collecting bureaucrats, its militarization of society, protectionism, economic fascism, suspension of habeas corpus, domestic spying, etc., etc. The Hamiltonian republic that we now live under, which is celebrated by the liberal/left and neocons alike, is the opposite of Jefferson’s dream of an “empire of liberty.”

And of course there is the Decleration of Independence. Agreed upon on July 2nd and officially recognized on the 4th.

I’d imagine if you watch mises.org or lewrockwell.com today you’ll get plenty of other articles on the topic of freedom, secession, etc.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/…

This time over the city’s efforts to make commuters pay for the roads that they use. This follows repeated calls by Councilman Vallone to secede made :

“I think secession’s time has definitely come again,” Mr. Vallone, who spearheaded a similar push in 2003, told The New York Sun yesterday. “If not secession, somebody please tell me what other options we have if the state is going to continue to take billions from us and give us back pennies. Should we raise taxes some more? Should we cut services some more? Or should we consider seriously going out on our own?”…”Not only is it about self-determination and self-rule, but it’s about fairness,” Mr. Vallone said. “It’s something we see every year in the budget. They take $11 billion from us and give us back a mere pittance and they make it seem like they’re doing us a favor to give that pittance back. Somehow they missed the point that that is New York City’s own tax money and we deserve it.”

With New Yorkers paying an average of $1,400 a year more to Albany than they recieve back, it’s no wonder that there are similar calls for secession in Long Island.

Given NYC is known for being very left wing and supporting of wealth redistribution and my own experience has shown this to be largely true… seems a bit hypocritical to me.

http://www.upi.com/…

Montana officials said its statehood contract will be breached if the U.S. Supreme Court rules only state-run militias can keep and bear arms.

While there’s no secession talk in Montana, 39 elected state officials signed a resolution declaring that if the court rules the Second Amendment to the Constitution is a right of states, not individuals, Montana’s compact would be violated, The Washington Times reported Monday.

“The U.S. would do well to keep its contractual promise to the states that the Second Amendment secures an individual right now as it did upon execution of the statehood contract,” Montana Secretary of State Brad Johnson said in a Feb. 15 letter to the Times.

The Supreme Court is expected to hear arguments on a federal court decision striking down the District of Columbia’s gun-ownership ban. The high court hasn’t issued a broad Second Amendment ruling in nearly seven decades, including whether it provides an individual right or a state government-held collective right, the Times said.

The Montana statehood contract, preserved as Article I of the state’s constitution, specifies gun ownership as an individual right, reading in part, “The right of any person to keep or bear arms … shall not be called into question.”

I thought the REAL ID would put the states and federal government at major odds first. Seems I may be wrong. This is pretty interesting. You rarely have people in these positions talking in this manner. I doubt very much anything will come of this but it’s fun nonetheless.

There is an issue I have with the Bill of Rights and its application. Through incorporation the federal government says that particular amendments apply to state governments. I have major issues with the fact that these cases where incorporation was cited are effectively random. They seem to create the need for incorporation on the spot instead of there being a blanket statement that in fact full incorporation has occurred. This has allowed for the federal government to cherry pick which it wants to enforce. A notable amendment not incorporated is the 2nd. If incorporation is legit it should be codified clearly by passing a new amendment which states without a doubt that all protected enumerated rights found in the federal constitution also apply to the states and the federal government has the power to pass and enforce laws to do so.

• The attack on the US embassy has resulted in the death of one person who’s burned body was found. I’ve yet to hear any identifying info.
• Russia is threatening to use “force to resolve the dispute over Kosovo’s declaration of independence from Serbia if NATO forces breach the terms of their U.N. mandate.”
• While watching CNN this morning report on rallies in Kosovo I saw 2 or 3 individuals wearing Che Guevara t-shirts. The city is 50/50 serb/albainian and there are great fears that it could turn violent. Let’s hope it doesn’t and those Che supporters aren’t the rock throwing types.
• Serbs have cell phones

• They only have US flags to burn in order to keep warm

• Foreign-owned shops were vandalized, Serbian police did nothing about it.
• Russia and China still oppose the declaration of independence and Spain is afraid that official recognition will encourage other secessionist movements… like the Basques in their north.
• Given that… blog of bile fully supports the people of Kosovo’s choice in becoming independent of Serbia and recognizes Kosovo as a nation. Don’t throw rocks at the Serbs unless they throw first.

New York Sun:

Emboldened by Mayor Bloomberg’s testimony in Albany this week that the city’s taxpayers pay the state $11 billion a year more than they get back, a City Council member is offering legislation that would begin the process of having New York City secede from New York State.

Peter Vallone Jr., a Democrat who represents Queens, is pushing the idea, and the Council plans to hold a hearing on the possibility of making New York City the 51st state.

“I think secession’s time has definitely come again,” Mr. Vallone, who spearheaded a similar push in 2003, told The New York Sun yesterday. “If not secession, somebody please tell me what other options we have if the state is going to continue to take billions from us and give us back pennies. Should we raise taxes some more? Should we cut services some more? Or should we consider seriously going out on our own?”

This is pretty unlikely. Not only would New York state be a bit crazy to let them go but Article 4 Section 3 Clause 1 doesn’t allow it without Congress’ approval:

New states may be admitted by the Congress into this union; but no new state shall be formed or erected within the jurisdiction of any other state, nor any state be formed by the junction of two or more states, without the consent of the legislatures of the states concerned, as well as of the Congress.

However, I fully support their plan. I’m a Free State Project member and some of us feel that if things continue getting worse nationally we will start supporting a New Hampshire secession from the union. That is also unlikely but given NH has the right to revolution in its constitution at least it has some legal legitimacy.

It does seem a bit funny to me that NYC is generally known to be fairly liberal place. A whole lot of socialists here. So you’d think that their wealth being redistributed to the rest of the state wouldn’t be a problem.